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CrtrTylr
 New Member
20 Posts
Brawley, Ca
USA
Harley-Davidson
Road King
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 Posted - 10/30/2009 : 5:04 PM
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See what I found while checking out my 2009 Road King last night. This was after I returned home from a trip last Friday and Saturday. This bike has 12000 miles on it and new tires were installed at 10k.
The weight of the motorcycle and the other side being tight got me home, but a violent bump or turn could of been disastrous.
 
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gymnast
Moderator
2211 Posts
[Mentor]
Meridian, Idaho
USA
Harley-Davidson
Sportster Sport
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 5:28 PM
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Things appear to be getting pretty close to a disaster there. I would be taking these pictures to the bussiness or whoever installed your new tires for you and asking a few choice questions and taking notes. If it were a franchised dealer, I would be asking the opinion of the franchiser in hard copy.
It appears that you caught things a couple of threads short of a disaster that could have resulted in significant or catastrophic losses.
Lastly, I would not want the business that installed the tires to ever lay a wrench on my bike again. |
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Night Train
Moderator
942 Posts
[Mentor]
Sydney, Nova Scotia
Canada
Harley-Davidson
Softail and Touring
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 5:51 PM
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I had the exact thing happen to my Night Train in 2002. I had the stock front lowers replaced with chrome lowers at the dealer along with extended tubes. The bike was done at the end of the season and they delivered it to me by truck during a snowfall after the work was done. I stored the bike over the winter in my garage and the first ride out in the spring, I headed into town to get a safety inspection. I had gone over the bike from stem to stern but had only visually inspected the front end. All was well including the lower axle support that is shown loose on yours. I rode the 20 miles into town and when they were doing the Safety Inspection I looked down at the front fork and noticed the bottom support had come off entirely. Needless to say it didn't pass inspection, the shop suggested I ride it very carefully on the way home. I left it there and took a cab home to get the stock one off the stock lowers and stopped and picked up two safety nuts (nylon core) and went back to the shop and installed the stock support on the chrome lower and torgued the safety nuts to spec. I got it passed for the inspection and then went straight to the Harley dealer who rechecked the complete front end and ordered a replacement chrome axle support for me. Since then I double check any work done by any shop and periodically check the torgue on all nuts and bolts. I also go through tubes of thread lock whenever I do my own service.
What amazed me was that the bike gave no indication that anything was amiss. The front end felt fine and there was no feel or sound to anything being wrong in the front end at all, even when going over bumps and potholes.
Yours looks like it was well on the way to coming off entirely. Mine did it in a space of 20 miles. The locking nuts have never come loose since and I replace them every year as they are fairly cheap and it does provide me with some peace of mind. I check them every time I check my tire pressure just to be sure.
I shudder to think what could have happened to either of us and wonder how many others have not been as fortunate as you and I. |
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CrtrTylr
New Member
20 Posts
Brawley, Ca
USA
Harley-Davidson
Road King
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 6:20 PM
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| I like the idea of the nylon nuts and loc-tite. All my inspections have been visual, time to get some wrenches out and do some checking on my own. |
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ananga73
Junior Member
28 Posts
Windsor Mill, MD
USA
Suzuki
M90
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 6:57 PM
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Wow! Thanks for posting, this definitely is a wake up call for me. Since I got my bike two months ago, I've never done the pre-ride inspection thing, figuring it was new.
I just downloaded the T-Clocs checklist from the MSF and will make sure to religiously do the checks. Our hobby is already a dangerous enough one and no need for me to up the ante. |
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twc
Advanced Member
627 Posts
[Mentor]
Fort Collins, CO
USA
Harley-Davidson
Electra Glide Ultra
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 7:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by ananga73
Wow! Thanks for posting, this definitely is a wake up call for me. Since I got my bike two months ago, I've never done the pre-ride inspection thing, figuring it was new.
Based on your response, I'm guessing you've never taken the MSF Basic Rider Course, either, since T-CLOCS pre-ride inspections are stressed in that course.
You should put the BRC on your "must" list. You'll learn lots of other valuable things as well.
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ananga73
Junior Member
28 Posts
Windsor Mill, MD
USA
Suzuki
M90
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 8:09 PM
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TWC,
I did take the BRC before purchasing my bike a couple of months ago. T-CLOCS was stressed in the CLASSROOM portion of the course however when we got to the range, the instructors said not to bother with going through the process because it would take time from the riding lessons.
From what I am reading on this site, the BRC has been HEAVILY watered down however what I find even more disturbing is that even the watered down BRC is not fully covered during the classes. I remember very clearly that in my class, we did not practice the exercise involving riding over an obstacle which is in Exercise 15. |
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vivid dadas
Standard Member
196 Posts
Columbus, OH
USA
Suzuki
V-Strom 650DL
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 8:40 PM
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That is horrible.
I took the BRC and do my pre-ride walk around, but that would be very easy to miss, especially if the nut backed off during the ride.
quote:
Based on your response, I'm guessing you've never taken the MSF Basic Rider Course, either, since T-CLOCS pre-ride inspections are stressed in that course.
I think that is a very smug response. It would take a sharp eye to see that a particular nut was loose or missing anywhere on the motorcycle. The picture makes ir obvious, but I don't think many people bend down check every nut. |
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twc
Advanced Member
627 Posts
[Mentor]
Fort Collins, CO
USA
Harley-Davidson
Electra Glide Ultra
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Posted - 10/30/2009 : 11:58 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by vivid dadas
I think that is a very smug response. It would take a sharp eye to see that a particular nut was loose or missing anywhere on the motorcycle. The picture makes it obvious, but I don't think many people bend down check every nut.
You have misunderstood the reference, because my response was not intended as smug, nor was it a comment about the mechanical failure.
quote:
Originally posted by ananga73
Since I got my bike two months ago, I've never done the pre-ride inspection thing, figuring it was new.
I think you'll have to agree that that's an improbable comment from someone who has completed the BRC that most of us remember. Now having learned that Paul (ananga73) has completed the course, I'm relieved in one sense, but surprised and concerned that the pre-ride inspection seems not to have been stressed. Paul adds weight to the concern when he mentions that riding over obstacles was also dropped, but that's somewhat less surprising. If I recall correctly, the Rider's Edge BRC class that I took was the last in our area that still did the riding over obstacles exercise. The other BRC classes had dropped it because of the risk involved.
The need for a pre-ride check was so thoroughly driven into me that I have a printed checklist tailored to each bike. They hang on the garage wall right next to where I park the bikes -- and I use them. One other point bears mentioning: If ever there's a time to go through your checklist in detail, checking every bolt and nut, it's when the bike is returned after servicing. The last thing you want to do is assume it's perfect because it just came back from the dealer.
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Mikeydude
Advanced Member
529 Posts
[Mentor]
Ft. Worth, Texas
USA
Harley-Davidson
03 FXD Super Glide
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 12:25 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by vivid dadas
I think that is a very smug response. It would take a sharp eye to see that a particular nut was loose or missing anywhere on the motorcycle. The picture makes ir obvious, but I don't think many people bend down check every nut.
Well... maybe this post will be a wake up call to those people so that they do bend down and check that nut. It could save their life... |
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Axiom2000
Moderator
527 Posts
[Mentor]
Georgetown, Delaware
USA
BMW
R1200RT/ R1200C
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 5:22 AM
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quote:
If I recall correctly, the Rider's Edge BRC class that I took was the last in our area that still did the riding over obstacles exercise. The other BRC classes had dropped it because of the risk involved.
Ananga73 if that exercise was not run during your BRC, shame on the coaches and administrators who run the classes in your area. The BRC exercise #15, Crossing Obstacles and Lane Changes, to my knowledge has never been officially dropped from the curriculum. Certainly not for any risk involved, unless someone is replacing the 2X4's ridden over with something more a lot hazardous.
This post is just an excellent example of the importance of the T-CLOCS pre-ride inspection. CrtrTylr if you don't mind I may just print out these pictures for use in classes to reinforce its importance. |
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SkootchNC
Senior Member
327 Posts
[Mentor]
raleigh, north carolina
USA
Harley-Davidson
road glide
Peer Review:
1
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 6:25 AM
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As much as I DISLIKE to clean a motorcycle......(I'd much rather be riding mine) I like to take a shop rag, and some Honda Spray, and wipe the grime, and gunk off the bike. While doing so, I pay attention to the nuts and bolts.
Basic BRC class went over the T-CLOCS, and drove home it's importance.
Assuming, that a new bike, wouldn't have loose or missing fasteners, is a no-no. While many of us hope, the bikes are uncrated, and assembled by experienced mechanics, I'm afraid the task, is often given to "the new kid".
I recommend each rider buy a service manual for their bike. Even if you have no intention of ever working on your bike, the manual will help you understand what the services are, and why they cost as much as they do. They will also show you where everything is, and how it's supposed to put together. |
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vivid dadas
Standard Member
196 Posts
Columbus, OH
USA
Suzuki
V-Strom 650DL
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 8:31 AM
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quote:
You have misunderstood the reference, because my response was not intended as smug,
Smug was too strong, sorry.
My point was that it would be very easy to miss something like that without a very careful pre-ride check. |
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WSMeders
Junior Member
25 Posts
OH, DC
USA
Yamaha
FZR600
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 10:11 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mikeydude
Well... maybe this post will be a wake up call to those people so that they do bend down and check that nut. It could save their life...
I second that. I was hoping to get some time in on my bike today but CrtrTylr's photos, and the weather, are having me stay in and do a good once over of the whole bike.
BRCs vary in their instructors, and their emphasis. That is obviously a concern, but I see this forum as an excellent adjunct to whatever safety courses taken. I recommend the site to everyone I meet on a bike.
PS - My front wheel is held on not by lower brackets, but a large 17mm bolt that travels all the way through the hub of the wheel and out the other side of the lower fork, with an allen bolt pinching the fork tight on both sides too.
It seems the bracket setup would be much more susceptible to be loosened by vibrations. |
Edited by - WSMeders on 10/31/2009 10:29 AM |
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twc
Advanced Member
627 Posts
[Mentor]
Fort Collins, CO
USA
Harley-Davidson
Electra Glide Ultra
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 11:07 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by vivid dadas
My point was that it would be very easy to miss something like that without a very careful pre-ride check.
Absolutely right. That's exactly why I didn't criticize the OP about pre-ride inspections.
Here's what I think happened: The bike was returned and this one nut was installed finger-tight but wasn't torqued properly. The mechanic just spaced it out for whatever reason. Even a visual inspection might have passed it. It was the vibration of the ride that worked the nut loose. Something that wasn't even noticed before the ride turned into a potentially fatal mechanical defect while on the ride.
This, of course, generates several questions:
- Are there such things as mechanical failures that no "reasonable" amount of care can prevent?
- Should this defect have been found during a normal pre-ride inspection?
- If not, does this suggest possible changes to our pre-ride inspections?
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twc
Advanced Member
627 Posts
[Mentor]
Fort Collins, CO
USA
Harley-Davidson
Electra Glide Ultra
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 11:25 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Axiom2000
Crossing Obstacles and Lane Changes, to my knowledge has never been officially dropped from the curriculum. Certainly not for any risk involved, unless someone is replacing the 2X4's ridden over with something more a lot hazardous.
Actually, we rode over 2x4's and 4x4's. Really: 4x4's.
The rider-coaches made sure that the obstacles remained perpendicular to our direction of travel and we did the rest. I think everyone was surprised at how well the bikes handled rolling over an obstacle that likely none of us would have attempted in any other setting. It was an eye opener. |
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CrtrTylr
New Member
20 Posts
Brawley, Ca
USA
Harley-Davidson
Road King
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 11:29 AM
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| I am constantly cleaning my bike, but this is when I visually inspect everything, how I found this problem. On my bicycles from my racing days, I always have wrenches to check stress points every few weeks, and in some places, every ride. I think I'll develope that same habit with my motorcycles. |
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twc
Advanced Member
627 Posts
[Mentor]
Fort Collins, CO
USA
Harley-Davidson
Electra Glide Ultra
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 11:35 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by CrtrTylr
See what I found while checking out my 2009 Road King...
...and, for the record, I just went out to the garage to check the nuts on the front axle retainer of my 2009 Electra Glide -- with a wrench. They were tight.
I think your post is going to have the desired effect.
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rkfire
Senior Member
416 Posts
Stratford, CT
USA
Suzuki
Bandit
Peer Review:
Blocked
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 11:57 AM
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My brand new bike was ridden home from the dealer. One mirror swung around loose and the headlight was pointed up high enough to be useless. When I got home and started checking nuts and bolts, I found the axle/chain adjuster on one side loose too.
My friend just bought a new Harley, a turn signal was loose, the headlight was crooked and high, and the tires were 20 and 10lbs underinflated.
I think the days where you were reasonably assured everything was done properly at the dealer is long past.
If you have work done, without a doubt check the work and all nuts and bolts that would be necessary to loosen to do that particular job. |
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scottrnelson
Advanced Member
4748 Posts
[Mentor]
Pleasanton, CA
USA
Ducati
ST2, 888, + XR650L
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 1:27 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by rkfire
My brand new bike was ridden home from the dealer. One mirror swung around loose...
That reminds me of when I bought a new Ducati Monster in 1997 in Fresno and had to ride it 160 miles back home. Both mirrors were hanging loose before I got 100 miles. I was able to get one of them to sort of stay in place, but I finally stopped off at an OHV park about 15 miles from home and borrowed a wrench to get it fully tightened.
The next new bike I buy, I'll spend a bit more time checking things before riding it home. Part of the purchase agreement will include having them adjust the suspension for me before riding it. |
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Texasphotographer
Advanced Member
746 Posts
[Mentor]
Copperas Cove, Texas
USA
Suzuki
2008 C50T
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Posted - 10/31/2009 : 2:29 PM
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| Thanks for posting this. Although I was conscientious about checking my bike before riding and usually all I noticed was tire pressue not right, this is a reminder of what can go wrong and not to take anything for granted. |
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